Clarivate Plc Price & Performance (CLVT)

Information about the factors that could cause actual results to differ materially from anticipated results or performance accounting found in Clarivate's filings with the SEC, and on the company's website. Our discussion will include non GAAP measures or adjusted numbers, Iraver believes non GAAP results are useful in order to enhance understanding of our ongoing operating performance, but they are supplement to and should not be considered in isolation from or as a substitute for GAAP financial measures. Reconciliation of these measures to GAAP measures are available in our earnings release supplemental presentation on our website. With me today are Mali Chemtaz, Executive Officer Jonathan Collins, Chief Financial Officer After our prepared remarks, we'll open up the call to your questions. And with that, it's a pleasure to turn the call over to Ramadi. So good morning, everyone, and thank you for joining us. On this call this morning, we are going to provide additional our 2024 results and our 2025 financial outlook. Our results demonstrate we have a strong foundation of products and assets and workflow solutions. They also show that we have work to do to deliver healthy organic growth and be for the future. We are underway to return to organic growth.

We have already started to implement our VCP, which I presented to you in Today, I will provide more detail on this plan, including some of the things we have already completed and will be doing in 2025. We also announced that we have retained financial advisors to help us in evaluating strategic alternatives to unlock value. This may include divesting business units, or an entire segment. There is no guarantees that anything actionable will arise from this process. We will provide update When appropriate, I'm confident this is the right plan to deliver shareholder value and return at Clarivate to healthy organic growth. Turning to Slide seven, let me give you a reminder of our value creation plan. Our VCP is focused on improving execution, and accelerating revenue growth. The first three pillars include revenue optimization, [indiscernible] and accelerating innovation innovation. These initiatives will improve our business performance, drive better revenue flexibility, and improve financial and operational efficiency Our fourth pillar, portfolio rationalization addresses opportunities to streamline our solutions portfolio through divestitures. Now let's talk about what was accomplished in the last three months in executing our plan and what lies ahead for the remainder of 2025.

Improving the predictability of our revenue and driving core subscription and reoccurring sales is key priority of the plan. In academia and government, we recently announced that we are moving to subscription only strategy for WordPress ebooks and digital collection. This is a meaningful step change in our go to market strategy for this product line. Progress ebooks, it is the world's largest subscription of academic ebooks including more than 700,000 titles. [indiscernible] offer more than 160,000,000 primary source items plus scholarly journals videos and audio specs.

With the launch of this new product offering, we will phase out one time transactional sales of ebooks by the end of twenty twenty five. The change will allow us to focus our growth on in subscription based solutions which will make up 90% of A and G portfolio. In Life Science, we launched DLT Fusion, a new modular subscription based real world data analytics Got it.

This will shift focus from transactional data brokering to new patient insight subscription products. We will dispose the increasingly high cost high risk data reselling business model we are positioning ourselves to offer broader set of complementary healthcare insight product which increased our value proposition to our life science buyers. We plan to exit Wilvo Data's direct licensing market winding down by fourth quarter twenty twenty six. As Jonathan will discuss, we expect benefit from moving in this strategic direction. It will reduced volatile transaction revenue by approximately $200,000,000 Accelerate organic growth make Clarivate more predictable by increasing our revenue mix from 80% to 87% and potentially higher over time. Improve our profit margin by approximately 150 basis points and has a minimal impact on our free cash flow. Now let's discuss what we've done on our sales execution. We have taken steps to improve sales execution. In each of the three segments, in the area of talent, organization, customer engagement and sales force in incentive Starting with people, we are attracting and promoting experienced proven sales leader specific functions Second, we have optimized reporting structure to increase accountability and empower regional sales leader to drive new business. This will strengthen our go to market capability and drive closer alignment with core strategic priorities.

We have also realigned account management models around specialty solutions area to capitalize on in house expertise and more closely align with our customer needs. Third, we are scaling and investing in dedicated customer success team. We are enhancing our resources, and tools to improve customer engagement and coverage Ultimately, this will help us to strengthen and grow retention rates along increasing our upsell and cross sell opportunities. And lastly, we are refocusing incentive models across the company to reward success for driving subscription, and reoccurring revenue growth This is there is more work to do in all this area, we have made substantial progress in a short time, Turning to our third pillar, product innovation. In recent years, we have made a lot of smart investment to harness the power of technology and AI.

We are seeing growing adoption and positive usage trends. For example, Academic AI platform was introduced and developed in a number of AMG products, including research assistant, Forego Science and Primo. It was also introduced in light it is also introduced within life sciences with our new product offering, DRG Fusion. And in IP with Dellent AI patent search. We continue to develop and enhance our product across all the three segments, which will drive improved customer adoption and usage Across academia, we are leveraging academic AI which includes the use of large language model to drive innovation ANDG is also strengthening the academic AI platform with agentic AI and will introduce a powerful AI agent builder and pre built AI agent 2025. Within Life Science, [indiscernible] is rapidly enhancing the Cortellis R and D platforms so integration of scientific AI research assistance by leveraging the AI [indiscernible] We also started implementing the implementation of Copelis Regulatory Intelligence Conversational Search. Within IP, we have series of exciting AI product launches in 2025 that will provide solution across the IP lifecycle. This includes enhanced AI patent drafting, a new AI patent monitoring product alongside of series of AI search capabilities trained on the Derwent unique proprietary data.

We expect this new product offering is to start to inflect in our ACV this year and currently expect most of the revenue benefits will come in 2026 and beyond. The fourth pillar of the BCP involves streamlining our solution portfolio to increase execution, optimize capital allocation and unlock value. Last year, we completed the divestiture of two product lines ScholarOne and Validat, we intend to continue rationalize our portfolios throughout the year. As I mentioned, we are already working with our financial advisor to help us evaluate strategic alternatives for business unit or an entire segment. Since rolling out our VCP plans last November, we undertook several important actions and achieved and achieved several key milestones. We recently completed company wide review of our teams processes and operations to streamline and improve efficiency, This is an important step in the value creation plan to fund investment and lower cost structure. Looking ahead, Slide 12 outlines our expect advancing the disposal and transition certain transactional products to subscription. We expect to complete the disposal of transactional book transactional books business and the transition of digital collection from transaction a subscription model In summary, the BCP is well underway We expect to return to BII We expect We expect it will return the business organic growth and now include a review of strategic alternatives which will include the sales of a business unit or an entire segment.

We are aggressively moving forward to improve operational performance our financial results and create shareholder value I look forward to sharing more details And with that, I would like to turn it over to Jonathan Johnson, please. Thank you, Maddy.

Slide 14 is an overview of our fourth quarter and full year financial results compared with the same periods from the prior year. Q4 revenue was $663,000,000 bringing the full year to $2,560,000,000 The fourth quarter change was largely inorganic as a result of the ScholarOne and Valley Pat divestitures as the rate of organic decline improved from 1.5% September year to date to 0.7% in the fourth quarter. The fourth quarter net loss was $192,000,000 an improvement of $671,000,000 compared to the same quarter and the full year net loss also improved by $319,000,000 both due to considerably lower non cash asset impairment charges related to goodwill and other Adjusted diluted EPS, which excludes the impact of one time items like the impairments, $0.21 in Q4 bringing the full year to $0.73 which was within the original guidance range we provided nearly a year ago. Operating cash flow was $141,000,000 in the quarter, taking the full year to $647,000,000 The change compared to last year is almost entirely driven by lower adjusted EBITDA and higher working capital. Please turn with me now to Page 15 for a closer look at the drivers the fourth quarter top and bottom line changes from the prior year.

At the end of the third quarter, our business had declined organically by 1.5% year to date However, we paired the rate of decline by 80 basis points to 0.7% in the fourth quarter on increased transactional sales which grew just over 0.5% largely due to improved performance in our A and G segment. The transactional growth was offset by a 1% decline in our recurring revenue types, subscription and reoccurring combined, which was largely driven by timing of year end patent renewals compared to the prior year. The net effect was a $5,000,000 reduction to organic revenue compared to the same period in the prior year, but careful operating expense management mitigated the revenue decline resulting in a $1,000,000 increase in adjusted EBITDA on the organic revenue change.

We experienced inorganic declines of $15,000,000 on the top line and $8,000,000 on the bottom line due to the ScholarOne and ValleyPath divestitures, were nominally offset by the acquisitions of GlobalQ and Rowan. Due to the recovery of the U. S. Dollar against a vast Compared to the same period last year. Page 16 provides an overview of the drivers of the full year top and bottom line changes compared to Our fourth quarter results brought our full year organic revenue change to a negative 1.4%, lowering revenue by $35,000,000 Recurring revenues were essentially flat organically as subs which was in line with our ACV growth was offset by recurring revenues. The entire organic change for 2024 was caused by our transaction lines of business which declined 6.5%. Operating expenses related to the organic change were down million dollars as cost inflation was more than offset by cost efficiencies. The Valley Pat and ScholarOne divestitures net of a small offset by the acquisitions of Motion Hall, Global Q and Rowan, caused inorganic declines of $32,000,000 on the top line and $18,000,000 on the bottom line. Foreign exchange lowered revenue by $5,000,000 and profit $9,000,000 compared to 2023 on the translation of foreign denominated subsidiaries and lower transactional gains.

Please turn with me now to Page 17 to step through the conversion from adjusted EBITDA to free cash flow. Free cash flow was $59,000,000 in the fourth quarter which brought full year free cash flow to $358,000,000 a conversion of 34% on adjusted EBITDA. The changes versus prior year driven largely by the lower adjusted EBITDA we just covered on the prior page, higher working capital largely due to timing of payments, and higher capital spending to accelerate product innovation. In the fourth quarter, we used a combination of the free cash flow we generated excess cash on hand and the proceeds from the Scholar one divestiture to prepay $140,000,000 of our term loan and repurchase another 19,000,000 shares of common stock. This brought our full year capital allocation to near symmetry between deleveraging and share repurchases at about $200,000,000 each. Please turn to page 18 where I'll dimension the impact of the strategic disposals relating to the first pillar of the VCP, business model optimization, that Mody outlined just a few moments ago, by illustrating the estimated impact these product lines had on our financial performance, [indiscernible] A central tenet of our value creation plan is to concentrate our focus on recurring revenues, which is the combination of our subscription and reoccurring order types.

In order to do this, we've strategically selected three product lines. We are exiting the transactional business model, and are introducing new subscription based offerings for select portions of each of these content sets. We anticipate multiple benefits from this strategic decision. We expect the business will grow faster will become more predictable will have improved profit margins, We'll increase the focus on our core businesses, improving the and will have a negligible impact on our free cash flow. These assumptions are based on our experience with these product lines over the last few years which is illustrated in the chart on the page. In the last column, we removed the impact estimated this decision would have had on last year's performance. Organic growth would have improved by 70 basis points due to a decline of 0.7%. Transactional revenues would have declined $200,000,000 Our revenue mix as defined by recurring revenues over total revenues would have improved by a full seven percentage points from 80% to 87%. While our adjusted EBITDA would have been lower by approximately 45,000,000 our profit margin would have been 150 basis points higher at about 43% and our capital spending would have been lower by $35,000,000 dollars with no impact on the conversion, which would have remained at 34%.

As Mody highlighted earlier in the call, the vast majority of these revenue streams will cease by the end of this year As a result, the impact I just outlined will phase in over the next couple of years. Let's turn to Page 19 for a look at our full year guidance for 2025 and then I'll highlight our assumptions for the impact these strategic Beginning at the top of the page, we expect our annual contract value to accelerate by approximately 60 basis points, 1.5% at the midpoint of the range as we begin to recognize the benefits of the investments we've made. Recurring organic growth will likely remain flat this year at the midpoint of the range. The organic growth improvement associated with the strategic disposal will primarily affect the transactional order type which is excluded from this metric. We anticipate revenue will approximate $2,340,000,000 at the midpoint of the range due to the strategic disposals, the divestitures last year and a stronger U. S. Dollar. As a result of the strategic disposals, we expect our recurring revenue mix will improve by about 500 basis points from 80% to 85% this year, which will improve predictability and profit margins going forward.

Moving down the page, we expect adjusted EBITDA in the range of $940,000,000 to $1,000,000,000 and to maintain margin of 41.5% due to aggressive cost management. We anticipate diluted adjusted EPS between $0.6 and $0.7 down $0.08 from last year at the midpoint as the inorganic driven adjusted EBITDA decline, which I'll detail on the next page, will be partially offset by lower interest expense as well as the benefit count resulting from last year's stock repurchases. And finally, at the bottom of the page, we anticipate free cash flow of about $340,000,000 at the midpoint of the range as the adjusted EBITDA change will be largely offset by improved conversion from lower interest working capital and capital spending. Please turn with me now to Page 20 for a closer look at the full year top and bottom line changes we're expecting compared to last year. The expected changes in revenue and adjusted EBITDA this year compared to last year are largely driven by three inorganic factors: and we're aggressively managing our cost structure to maintain our profit margin at about 41.5%. First, the strategic disposals are expected to lower revenue this year by approximately $140,000,000 but we're implementing $100,000,000 of cost actions which yield a profit impact of about $40,000,000 We expect the remaining $60,000,000 revenue reduction will take place next year and will have a small impact on profit.

Our revenue guidance range is intended to accommodate for potential variability in the rate of decline of this revenue stream and we will actively manage our cost structure to ensure we deliver the expected profit outcome. Second, the divestitures of both Valley Pat and ScholarOne last year were lower revenue by $40,000,000 and profit by $20,000,000 And finally, we anticipate a $25,000,000 foreign exchange translation headwind on the top line and a headwind of about $10,000,000 on the bottom line as the U. S. Dollar is expected to remain strong against the basket of foreign currency. These reductions to adjusted EBITDA will be largely mitigated in free cash flow let's turn to Page 21 to step through the main drivers. One time costs are expected to remain flat this year as we invest to achieve the cost efficiencies associated with the value creation plan. We do expect cash interest to improve by about $20,000,000 compared to last year as a result of the debt we prepaid in the fourth quarter and the outlook for base rates via the forward curve. Cash taxes are expected to remain in line with last year. We anticipate the change in working capital this year will be negligible which will represent an improvement over last year of about $20,000,000 And while we remain committed to investing in product innovation, the strategic disposals and cost efficiencies will improve capital spending by about $35 The net impact of these changes is free cash flow of about $340,000,000 at the midpoint of the range and will result in an improvement of the conversion on adjusted EBITDA of about 100 basis points.

From a capital allocation perspective, we continue to have the flexibility between opportunistic share repurchases and deleveraging. In closing, we believe we have a strong foundation to build upon with best in class data and workflow assets that we deliver as a trusted provider from a blue chip customer base. Underpinned by a robust financial profile and powered by a talented team of 12,000 colleagues around the world. As Mody outlined, we believe the value creation plan narrows our focus to increase our performance and will return the business to healthy organic growth in the next few years leading to profit and cash flow accretion. We are committed to providing the near term progress on the leading indicators of We have also acknowledged that there are multiple paths to create value for shareholders, and we are actively engaging with our advisors to review and pursue strategic alternatives that could accelerate the value creation by monetizing undervalued assets. I want to thank all of you for listening in this morning. I'm now going to turn the call back over to Kate to take questions And as a reminder, please limit yourself to one question and then we'll have you return to the queue for any additional Your first question comes from the line of Manav Patnaik with Barclays.

Please go ahead. Yes. Thank you. I guess I had a broader question just around your overall government exposure. A lot of questions [indiscernible] what your direct exposures to the federal and state governments and also I guess indirectly, if they all get there, the academic endowment solutions, especially if they get their funding platform in other areas, how you think you can manage that as well? So hi, Matias. I'm going to answer this one. Thank you for the question. So the academia business for almost [indiscernible] I've seen the academia business going through lot of different cycles. And I remain optimistic that academia will prevail and will continue to grow [indiscernible] low single digit to mid single digit over time. Yes, we do have a percentage of our Income coming from the U. S. Government spending, it's pretty small. But we do acknowledge the fact that if the federal fund will go down, we have we will be exposed to those if they are if the cuts are significant, we will be exposed. But as I mentioned, earlier in my call, I'm optimistic about the trajectory and the future of this industry. I've been there for twenty years, gone through several cycles, optimistic and positive about the future of the business.

Thank you. Next question please. Your next question comes from the line of Andrew Nicholas with William Blair. Please go ahead. Hi. Thank you for taking my questions. Wanted to focus on the incentive model changes for the sales force Can you maybe spend some time talking about the evolution of those comps structures and maybe more specifically how you expect it to to change execution and success on that front.

Without systematically without going into too much details into the call like this the models were tailored over years. With a certain focus on one time versus subscription. They were focused on certain way with certain percentage on one time retention and new business So in all of the three segments, we view as a portion of the salesperson incentive which goes into one time retention and new business and we changed the model. We changed a little bit We kind of fine tuned this model to our salespeople with our concept that we go strongly after subscription and reoccurring so that salespeople should be compensated accordingly and incentivize accordingly. Retaining, making sure that we are growing the retention rate and making sure we are selling more subscription as opposed to one time business. That's what we're doing.

In all three segments.

Your next question comes from the line of George Tong with with Goldman Sachs. Please go ahead. Hi, thanks. Good morning. Reoccurring revenue in the quarter [indiscernible] Recurring revenue in the quarter fell about 5% because of lower IT patent renewal volumes. You talked a little bit about timing at year end, but can you discuss initiatives under the value plan that can help improve reoccurring patent revenue trends Sure, George. Yes, so the first part of your question the primary driver of the decline in Q4 on the reoccurring order type were were patent renewal volumes, they were lower due to the comparison with the prior year. We had expected more of those to be renewed in Q4. Earlier in the year, and some of those now are happening in the first quarter. So that's the primary driver of the fourth quarter change. To your point on the go forward, it piggybacks a little bit on Matt Mady's last comment, which is our sales incentive and focus for 2024 is more geared now towards the recurring order types. So by winding down some of these transactional business and shifting the the pay mix towards the recurring revenue types. We expect to help build the book of business, not only in subscriptions, but also on our patent and trademark renewal business within the IP segment.

Got it. Very helpful.

Thanks for the question.

Your next question comes from the line of Owen Lau with Oppenheimer. Please go ahead.

Hi, good morning. Thank you for taking my question.

So first of all, thank you for the detail on the BCP and 2025 guidance. And I do have a broader question on this. So there's a trade off for your BCP revenue and free cash flow would be down in 2025 because of inorganic disposal and also divestitures you can drive high organic ACV and recurring revenue mix. Why do you think this is the right And can we turn the company back to revenue growth trajectory in 2026 beyond. I think this is Matthew and maybe Jonathan can add later. So when I came in, I've done my study. I met a lot of sales organization. I met the managers. I met customers. And the notion that I brought through this And some of my prior knowledge of A and G, I've run progress before. The amount of energy and effort and attention and the drain we got from those one time deals.

Like this tiles business And I'm also understand that the real world data is kind of the same. It's It's a lot of effort to do one time deal and it's a distraction add to this The low margin of the ebooks business very low margin of the ebooks business It was kind of a very intuitive decision when we discussed the VCP with the management. This is a dream. This is This is just taking over time. And let's we have a great engineering and product capabilities within the company, we have some very great products. And we were also smart about transitioning the three and maybe we haven't spent enough time on this one. The three businesses we're actually winding down we didn't really wind them down. We actually we are transitioning them towards subscription. The progress, ebooks, offering, which is subscription based, the largest in the industry. The progress data collection. We are almost the only vendor that provides those kind of services. [indiscernible] offering, this is all we are transitioning the business as opposed to just purely disposing the business When I came here, there was some mumbling about maybe you can sell this business, maybe we cannot sell this business.

The notion that we have actually moved those businesses And over time, we have a a high degree of conviction that we believe where we can transition this one time business, maybe not one to one, but over time we'll transition into more subscription recurring subscription base. This is what we do A big portion of our business is going subscription. And I mentioned we are moving from 80% to 87% subscription reoccurring after disposals, and I believe we can go even higher.

Great. Thank you. Next question please. Your next question comes from the line of Shlomo Rosenbaum with Stifel.

Hi.

Thank you for taking my question.

I have a question in terms of the rate of investment in terms of new product innovation, like the key value driver in the company is really going to be moving the organic revenue growth up. [indiscernible] the capital spending in 2025 is going down. You're keeping the margins relatively flat despite dropping $200,000,000 out of revenue I'm just wondering, is there enough company to drive a sustainable long term organic growth rate that is going to be respectable. Yes. Thank you for the question, Shlomo.

Jonathan. Just to point out a couple of items. Our ability to maintain our margins and lower our capital expenditures this year in 2025. Is directly correlated with the strategic disposals. So the way that we are thinking about this is we are continuing to invest in the core products. If it weren't for this we would see some margin pressure because as you know, we firmly believe we need to [indiscernible] our ability to maintain margins and the ability to maintain our cash flow are a result of the strategic disposals that Mady highlighted that will help us to focus on the core business and have a good execution on those investments. Thank you.

I believe this is Matthew. We have the right profile of investment into our business. And let's not forget, Geir and his team before me, they were focusing on innovation as well and have introduced some very great products. If you look at academic AI, they would was introduced in the A and G segment, which is empowering most of the ENG products most of the product lines are Web Science, Primo, ebooks, business. We are using this repurposing the same framework and technology And one of the other things that I've introduced when coming in, I say, why don't we just take whatever was developed, the infrastructure and technology within AMG, and implemented in other segments, and what we're doing today is actually implementing the academic AI in capabilities and know how in two other segments and the first one obviously life science. And we are going to implement academic AI Infrastructure and know how technology in two, Cortell is trying to expedite on some of the improvement we need to do within Cortellis. We are pretty pretty optimistic about this one. We did sign or we are signing up some development partners for this changes that we are doing in Cortellus.

These days and more to come.

Your next question comes from the line of Surrender Thind with Jefferies. Please go ahead.

Thank you. Just following up on the earlier question. Why not take margins down further at this point to kind of maybe speed up investment at this point? And then as you talk about taking technologies from one segment to another or moving things across. Does that make the what I will call the divestiture process a bit more complex? Or how do we take those things into consideration as you do some of that stuff.

First of all, maybe to talk to Octavio, about the divestitures, I think there is a lot of logic to have those three segments together. There's a lot of advantages, synergies, but those three segments can also operated on a standalone basis. Yes, there will be some exercise of separation the segments if need be.

I don't think and yes, when we make a decision to implement some of the technologies with from LNG and others, Yes, we take into consideration that maybe in future those segments will not be together. I don't think this is a big issue going forward. I think we have the right level of investment I'm not suggesting we take the margin down. For me, when I came in, there was I would tend to do less number of project or new products, but be laser focused And that's my claim to fame, and it's something we've done in previous life.

I work with the customers So we sign up I mentioned that we are signing up development partnership for Cortellis the implementation of AI with Cortellis. I find that we simply are doing we are doing in a company too many small things as opposed to go being or go more aggressive on certain initiatives. And this is where we're taking the company. I don't feel I'm pressured by the level of R and D or for innovation investment, I think we are in the right place.

Thank you. Next question please. Your next question comes from the line of Peter Christiansen with Citi.

Thank you. Good morning. Marty, I was curious, you've you've reviewed the business, you had a lot more time to look at it. And just thinking in the context of keeping all the three business lines together or potentially separating them, how should we think about the revenue synergy potential between these businesses are you more confident, less confident in the ability to drive that Those additions And then just curious how you think about new products Are they value added pricing kind of opportunities or TAM expansion?

So they are both TAM expansions and also additional three different segments. But if first of all, I feel good about where we are in the pilot creation plan. Going winding down those one time is going to give us a lot of freedom to focus on the new products So new products are expanding the time in some cases and some they are some of them are just improving the product. So for example, you take a web of science, In Web of Science, we do ongoing investment, but we also introducing and we haven't talked about it today, it's like the Web of Science Research Intelligence Web of Science Research Intelligence is like AI enablement. It's an advanced version of insights. Which basically this is after expanding the sum. We're going to offer new services to our new product to our existing customer base. On IP, for example, we also doing some new innovation, a product called IPCH, which we are already sitting with a lot of law firm and all of corporate. So it is a new product that we will be we are working on. We have we have Nestle as a customer. We want to expand it and to go to the market aggressively with additional [indiscernible] More on this area will come, but we are looking into customer base, but also expanding expanding the wallet share within the customers as well.

Thank you. Our last Our last question comes from the line of Ashish Sabadra with RBC Capital Markets. Please go ahead.

Thanks for taking my question. So on the organic AACV inflection in 2025, how much of that is really coming from transitioning some of those trans revenue more to subscription based versus an improved pipe pipeline and demand environment. And so I was wondering if you could comment on the pipeline and the demand environment and what you're seeing on that front? And then if I can just sneak in a question on the strategic review, I was just wondering if you could provide any kind of high level color on what are the key strategic or financial criteria that you will use as part of the strategic review?

Ashish, maybe we can start with the latter question So as we indicated in the script, what we'll explore is the opportunity to unlock value through potentially monetizing more valuable assets that aren't commanding that value based on where the company is valued today. So that's going to be a key criteria. And as Maddy high highlighted, we do believe that there are parts of our business including entire segments that are separable and can can survive and thrive separate from Clarivate. So that's how we're thinking about it in the criteria. As it relates to ACV, it's going to be a combination of factors. As you know, there will be some conversion associated with some of these new products, but the bigger benefit we expect to see are the investments in products that we've made over the last couple of years. So we've talked a lot about in each of our segments. Continued investments we've made in the Web of Science and our research solution products within A and G. Think about the investments we've made in Cortellus in the Life Sciences Group, and the investments we've made in Derwent with the new AI powered search just launching here in the last few months.

So a combination of those with some potential benefit with the conversion to subscription products related to the VCP strategic disposals That's what we believe will help to improve us into that 1% to 2% range on ACV. Thanks for the question Ashish.

Thank you all for joining us today. That will conclude our call. We look forward to updating you in the future on our VCP plans.