Kennedy-Wilson Holdings, Inc. Price & Performance (KW)

I would now like to turn the call over to our Chairman and CEO, Bill McMorrow. Thank you, Devin, and thank you everybody for joining the call today. Yesterday, we reported our results for the fourth quarter, which represented a strong ending to solid year of executing on our strategic initiatives. Including increasing our baseline EBITDA growing our investment management business, disposing of non core assets, reducing unsecured debt and finding meaningful ways to deploy new capital with our many institutional partners. We saw great momentum in our earnings this quarter with improvements across all key components of adjusted EBITDA. Which nearly tripled from $190,000,000 in 2023 to $540,000,000 in 2024. On today's call, I'll start by reviewing the progress made on our key initiatives in 2024, followed by a discussion of our priorities for 2025 before turning it over to Justin Headbody to discuss our financial results.

The overall market environment is showing steady improvement Debt markets are strengthening with lower base rates and tighter spreads. While transaction volume is clearly rebounding. Against this backdrop, our investment activity accelerated in 2024 with over $4,000,000,000 of capital deployed including $3,500,000,000 in our debt originations and $800,000,000 in rental housing and industrial acquisitions. An increase of over 50% from 2023 levels.

Strengthening liquidity and improving market sentiments supports the continued expansion of our investment management business. Investment management fees grew by 60% year over year to approximately $100,000,000 in 2024, reaching a major milestone for the company. Fees have grown from $25,000,000 in 2019 to the previously mentioned $100,000,000 in 2024.

Significant driver of this growth has been our credit platform which has seen huge momentum in the last year. We completed a record $1,400,000,000 of new loan originations Q4 and 3,500,000,000.0 for the year.

All focused on construction of high quality market rate multifamily and student housing. This momentum has carried over into 2025 with $1,500,000,000 in new originations in closing or already completed year to date.

Additionally, we have seen meaningful growth in the interest to deploy capital into real estate equity from our institutional partners. A prime example of this is the launch of the new UK single family rental strategy the Canadian Pension Plan CPP, one of the world's largest global investors with approximately $500,000,000,000 in assets under management. We are off to a strong start in this new platform with total committed capital of $361,000,000 or approximately 30% of the strategy current target of $1,300,000,000 Further highlighting our growth in investment management, we successfully closed fundraising on our seventh discretionary co mingled fund securing $400,000,000 discretionary capital for U. S. Investments We remain focused on attracting capital from leading institutional investors across North America, Asia Europe and The Middle East. Who we expect to be increasingly active in the equity markets. In total, we believe we continue to grow our investment management fees by approximately 20% to 25% per annum. Second important initiative has been recycling capital through our non core asset sales. In Q4, generated $122,000,000 in cash proceeds from non core sales.

Bringing our 2024 total $475,000,000 of [indiscernible] And $200,000,000 of gains generated from asset sales. With our Q4 activity, we have successfully achieved our $550,000,000 asset sale target set last year. Looking ahead, capital recycling remains a core focus with an expected generation of over $400,000,000 of cash in 2025 through asset sales, recapitalizations or using assets we currently own to seed new investment We intend to deploy this capital into higher return opportunities particularly within our investment management platform while we continue to reduce the company's unsecured debt which is our third key initiative for the year. In December, we repaid $185,000,000 of our KWE bonds leaving $310,000,000 maturing in November the only remaining unsecured maturity until 2028.

We also made significant progress on our revolving credit facility repaying $78,000,000 in Q3. Turning to our portfolio. Our real estate equity and credit investments totaled $28,000,000,000 in assets under management producing an estimated annual NOI of $467,000,000 for the company. Our fee bearing capital stands at a record $8,800,000,000 Over the last several years, we have meaningfully repositioned our portfolio with approximately two thirds of our stabilized assets now concentrated in rental housing, comprising the 60,000 Yes. We either own or are currently financing. The outlook for our apartment portfolio, which ended the quarter with 95% occupancy continues to improve. Same property NOI grew by a solid 5.6% in Q3 Supply headwinds in most of our markets are easing Our NOI This dynamic should provide a very favorable backdrop for rental housing fundamentals going forward. As market conditions continue to recover, we remain well positioned to capitalize on new opportunities with a continued focus on rental housing and industrial assets. With over three decades of experience navigating various interest rate environments, We have the flexibility now to deploy capital across the entire real estate capital structure. We anticipate a very active year and remain committed to execute on our previously mentioned key initiatives in 2025.

While continuing to strengthen our balance sheet and growing our recurring cash flow. I'd now like to turn the call over to our CFO, Justin Enbodie.

Thanks, Bill. I'll start by reviewing our financial results and then discuss our balance sheet.

GAAP EPS totaled EBITDA totaled $191,000,000 in Q4 with improvements across the board at all key components. This includes baseline EBITDA, which totaled $98,000,000 in Q4, and has increased by 4% year to date to $4.00 $7,000,000 also saw a meaningful improvement in the results from our co investment real estate portfolio. This portfolio totals roughly $14,000,000,000 in assets in which we have an ownership of approximately 35%. Valuations in that portfolio saw a slight increase in Q4. Additionally, estimated annual NOI from our co investment portfolio totaled $217,000,000 of which 90% is comprised of either multifamily industrial or loan investment Turning to our balance sheet and debt profile. An important priority for us has been to reduce our unsecured debt Bill mentioned, During Q4, we repaid a total of $262,000,000 of unsecured debt including repaying $184,000,000 of KWE bonds €175,000,000 as Bill mentioned and 78,000,000 on our revolving credit facility. With that, we ended the quarter with $218,000,000 of consolidated [indiscernible] and $452,000,000 of undrawn availability on our $550,000,000 line of credit. We also continue to monitor our exposure to potential interest rate volatility. Our share of total debt is 97% fixed or hedged with a weighted average maturity of four point nine years and a weighted average effective interest rate of 4.6%.

The effective rate includes the benefit from our interest rate hedging strategy which produced cash benefits of $8,000,000 in Q4 and $41,000,000 2024. It's worth noting this is not shown as an offset to interest expense on our P and L. Our interest rate hedges on average have a strike rate that is approximately 100 basis points below today's rates as well. Looking at our debt maturities in 2025, as we mentioned earlier, euros remaining on our KWB bonds which represents the final legacy tranche of what was originally $1,300,000,000 of unsecured debt at KWE across two separate bond issuances. On the secured side, we have $535,000,000 of debt at share that matures in '25. With approximately 70% relating to our high quality assets in Iralect, In particular, our Irish apartment portfolio has approximately $210,000,000 of debt that we are in the process of refinancing and with rates expected in the mid-4s. The balance of our remaining 25 maturities largely relate to our U. S. Apartment and commercial properties. With that, I'd now like to turn the call over to Matt Windish to discuss our investment Thanks, Justin. I'd like to take a moment to review the key components of our real estate portfolio.

Before diving into our investment management business. Today, our stabilized portfolio generates estimated annual NOI of $467,000,000 with an additional 65,000,000 expected from our lease up and development portfolio. Upon stabilization. The shift in our portfolio away from office and retail has continued to progress. With our current stabilized portfolio, 72% concentrated, in our high conviction sectors of rental housing, both equity and credit, as well as industrial. This is up from forty nine percent five years ago. Our apartment portfolio is the cornerstone of this strategy. Contributing $300,000,000 of NOI to KW with another $16,000,000 expected from assets that are currently in development and lease up. In The U. S, renter fundamentals continue to strengthen. Demand for our apartment portfolio remains strong, driven in part by the high cost of homeownership. Which continues to push many At the same time, seeing a reduction in supply pressures in many of our markets, a trend we expect to ease further in the second half of the year into 2026. During the fourth quarter, we maintained a sharp focus on occupancy increased by 1.1% to 95% on a same property basis. Leasing spreads totaled 50 basis points with renewal spreads remaining strong at approximately 4%.

As a result, same property revenue grew by 2.7% with NOI up 6.2%. These results underscore the strong operational execution by our asset management team. Turning to our regional highlights. Our strongest which remains our largest apartment region. Occupancy grew by 1%, while revenue grew by a solid three In addition to the top line growth, we benefited from a decline in operating expenses driven by favorable adjustments in real estate taxes in Idaho and lower delinquent These factors combined to deliver impressive same property NOI growth of 7.3%. In the Pacific Northwest, occupancy grew by 1.5% with revenues up 3.9% while operating expenses remained flat. Leading to 6.6% NOI growth. We remain optimistic about our Pacific Northwest portfolio in 2025 as return to office mandates have started this year many large employers in the region. Our California apartment portfolio has recovered from the delinquency challenges we saw A year ago. We saw solid occupancy growth and lower delinquency related which resulted in NOI growth of 2% in Southern California and 4% in Northern California. Our vintage housing affordable portfolio delivered strong in NOI. This growth was driven primarily by revenue increases that closely aligned to changes in area median income, and with improved levels of bad debt.

Reflecting the strength and resilience of our affordable housing strategy. As our vintage portfolio approaches 13,000 stabilized affordable units, We remain focused on identifying opportunities to scale our affordable housing footprint. Ensuring we continue to meet the growing demand for high quality accessible housing. Turning to our Irish apartment portfolio, remains robust.

With our assets ending the quarter at a strong 97% occupancy.

We have one remaining apartment asset currently in lease up which is on track to reach stabilization by this summer. The significant and ongoing structural under supply of housing in the Dublin market combined with continued employment growth reinforces the sustained demand we expect for our high quality rental communities. Now turning to our office portfolio. Of which approximately 80% of the estimated annual NOI is derived from our investments in Europe. We saw 2% same property NOI growth in 2024. Stabilized occupancy remains healthy at 93% with a weighted average lease term of seven years to expiration and four point four years to break. In The UK, our stabilized office with a wealth of five point four years to expiration and four point one years to break. In Q4, we completed leasing transactions across 123,000 square feet with both existing and new tenants representing a 49% increase above previous in place rents. In Dublin, where our stabilized occupancy exceeds 96%, our high quality sustainable properties continue to benefit from a flight to quality. Dublin saw a strong recovery in leasing demand with gross leasing activity in the last two quarters of twenty twenty four. Surpassing the total leasing activity for all of 2023.

This positive momentum is an encouraging sign for our Cooper's Cross asset which recently welcomed Wells Fargo as its first tenant and where we see a healthy pipeline of continued leasing interest. Switching gears over to our investment management business, reaching nearly $100,000,000 in fees, and a record $8,800,000,000 in fee bearing capital, were major milestones for KW in 2024. We believe we have laid the foundation to continue to develop [indiscernible] on behalf of our institutional partners across both equity and debt opportunities, with a goal of continuing to grow our fees at over 20% per year. The expansion of our credit team in 2023 and the rise of private credit investment has allowed us to scale our fee bearing capital.

In Q4, we completed $1,400,000,000 of originations, as our platform continues to gain momentum. We also completed over $300,000,000 in new fundings and received approximately $500,000,000 of repayments in the quarter. Our credit business has $4,100,000,000 of future fundings, which we anticipate start picking up within the next twelve months as an offset to future repayments. As the private credit markets continue to remain very active, are evaluating a number of ways to capitalize on this dynamic and grow our credit platform. In The U. K, we see a compelling opportunity through our single family rental platform to acquire housing in bulk from UK homebuilders and create vibrant new rental communities. With the ongoing demand and supply imbalance in The UK residential market, particularly in the single family rental sector, We believe there is a significant opportunity to build an institutional quality portfolio of scale in a market that has historically been highly fragmented. We're excited about the growth potential of this platform the value it can deliver over the long term. We also anticipate further growth from our European which totals 9,000,000 square feet and is 98% occupied.

We completed 390,000 square feet of leasing which delivered a 23% increase in rents in Q4 and we are evaluating a number of ways to continue to grow this platform. Thus, it is the expansion of these as well as our other initiatives underway that will support further growth in our investment management business. In closing, I believe the improvements we made as a company during these last few years have positioned KW for solid growth in 2025 and beyond. We remain confident in our strategy, our portfolio, and our team's ability to deliver long term value for all of our stakeholders. So with that, operator, we can open it up to any questions. Thank you. We will now begin the question and answer session. And your first question today will come from Anthony Paolone with JPMorgan. Yes, thanks and hi everybody. My first question is maybe just clarify. I think [indiscernible] proceeds from some dispositions in 2025. I guess, did I hear that right? Yes. Okay. Any areas where there's a particular shift or or group of assets that are to be sold or is this just pretty broad continued recycling Tony, this is Matt.

So I think it will be a similar strategy to what we deployed in 2024. So in particular, we really want to focus in on our core competencies, which are really housing related investments as well as our investment management business. So assets that don't fit in those parameters. So whether it's wholly owned office retail assets, We've talked about exiting markets like Italy and Spain. Spain of which we now have exited. Those will continue to be the focus for us on our non core disposition strategy Then in terms of how we use those proceeds we're going to continue to pay down unsecured debt and we're going to fund some of these co investment Okay, great. And then regards to the debt platform, you have a lot of commitments And just wondering if a lot of committed capital to that, I guess. If that construction lending environment gets more competitive, particularly in the residential space, like what's the latitude you all have to call in those commitments and just go elsewhere either for existing mortgages, other property types, etcetera.

Yes, Tony. So I think some of those commitments we're talking about, we've already made the loans and we just have future funding obligations under those. So those obviously aren't going anywhere Those are loans we've already signed up. Look, we think the construction lending space within the areas operate right now. Continue to be extremely compelling, We're a market leader in the space both for apartment construction as well as student housing construction. The pipeline remains robust. So we think we're going to have a very successful year in that space. That being said, there are other opportunities that we're evaluating. For different product types and other types of financing that our existing team can execute on. And so we do expect over time here to expand the offerings and grow the credit platform in different ways.

Okay. And if we think about fee bearing AUM and the growth of that as we look ahead, how important do you think it is to also add just more equity capital into the mix that maybe has a bit longer duration to it.

That's a really good question, Tony. I think what might not be completely evident is the amount of institutional partners we've been cultivating that primarily want to invest in The United Kingdom and The United States And they want to invest in the asset classes that we have the most expertise in, which is the rental housing and the credit business and the industrial business. Capital partners that aren't really yet reflected. And as you well know, the biggest piece of our Our capital we use to deploy really comes from separate accounts.

Not necessarily discretionary funds.

And as you saw in The United Kingdom, Mike together the partnership with CPP, but there's a big number of those going on that are yet finished.

And so when you think about this year, as I said in my part of the formal part of this. We expect to deploy more capital this year than we did [indiscernible] And when you look at last year, roughly 80% to 85% of the capital that we deployed was in the credit space. But I expect that this year, although the credit space will continue to be a big portion of it we're going to see more equity opportunities And the reason we didn't invest in the equity opportunities the last couple of years is we just didn't see anything that we thought was really But we're starting to see I'd say more realistic pricing that we the kind of pricing that we like to see to generate the kind of returns that we want to see.

So you're going to going to see more equity deployed into that business. And the other part of it is that we are very focused on growing our construction management capabilities where we're with smaller part of the capital structure.

In the past, if you remember in Ireland, for example, fifty-fifty partners with AXA.

But we've got great expertise in the construction management business. Both here in The United States and in Europe.

And we expect over time that we're going to find more opportunities to [indiscernible] build new multifamily assets, but where we're a smaller part of the capital and earning construction management fees So I think the point that Matt made was really important that when you talk about selling these non core assets, it's really with the intent increase our exposure to the asset classes that we really like The rental housing business both equity and credit in the industrial business. I think over time, you're going to see that grow up to 85% to 90% of our investment activity every year.

Okay, great. That's real helpful. Just one last one if I can.

I'm curious, you mentioned refinancing some of the debt in Ireland in the mid-4s. What was the what's the in place that it will be replacing? I'm just trying to get a sense as to to where those debt markets are now versus kind of what was in place before?

I'm going to let Matt answer part of the question, but I think the interesting thing and I think it kind of validates What we're talking about, we're closing the financing, which is almost $500,000,000 in April.

We had 35 banks and lenders that proposed to us on that. And we've selected two financial institutions to do The $500,000,000 that as we mentioned is going to be around in the mid-4s at the end of the day for five year fixed rate debt.

I'll let Matt now talked about the differential in interest rates.

Yes. So the in place rate was just under 3%. And we're going to be like we said in the mid-4s, but we will have the ability to float down on that. So if rates do come down, we will have an ability to participate. But we will be locked in. So the rate won't rates will not go much higher than the mid-4s.

Yes. I think too, Matt, you've got to correct me here. But last year, Tony, when you look at it, we either financed or refinanced on our existing assets almost a $300,000,000 of property level and the differential in interest rates, the actual whole dollar differential was very, very minimal.

Right. Okay. Thank you for the color.

And your next question today will come from Tayo Okusanya with Deutsche Bank. Yes. Good afternoon, everyone. The SFR platform could you talk a little bit about what you expected kind of yields and margins are on that business and also around the up Mike, do you want to take that one? Yes, I'll take that one. Look, we're really excited about growing this this platform.

We've got a really good pipeline of hazards that we've got that we're trying to acquire at discounts from a house builders and create these new rental communities. Think the yields that we can set up to are probably a little bit higher than we've seen in U. K. Residential in recent years. We're probably talking about we're stabilizing in the high 5% towards 6%. Over the course of our the whole period In terms of the operations, we've got a great team in place with a lot of experience that we can capture from around the world where we've been doing this in Ireland and The U. S. S. So we think this is absolutely part of Kennedy-Wilson core skill set of how to manage and optimize these homes and create great communities in place for people to live.

So we're really excited about the prospect of growing this platform with a fantastic partner such as CPPIB.

Got you. So is it a third party property management house?

We've got our in house asset management team, but we took support that with an outsourced property management solution where appropriate.

And I think scale, we'll reevaluate how that how best to operate that. But initially, we'd be looking at third party property management. Just to supplement our own internal resources.

Got you. And then on the debt Our platform, again, really strong origination this quarter, really strong pipeline in place as well with $1,000,000,000 And how should we be thinking about what a run rate could look like for that business in terms of originations? And also future funding, just given probably at some point we need more capital to keep growing at the current case you're growing at.

Yes. So last year, we did 3,500,000,000.0 of originations. And I think we certainly would like to exceed that this year, assuming the opportunity set presents itself, which as of now feels like it is. And then in terms of funding sources, we obviously have some great partners in this business. But there's a lot of demand from other investors we've been talking to. Who want to continue to grow with us. So we feel very, very strongly that we've got the capital we need to continue to grow this platform over over the long run, and assuming the opportunity set remains attractive.

That's helpful. And then two questions on some of the international portfolio. Again, Dublin, the current rent caps on multifamily there of about 2%. Curious how you think that ultimately evolves with the new Irish government then also on The UK side with the autumn budget from late last year, any implications for kind of office demand in 2025, since some of the budget calls for higher kind of costs of employees according to some of the new Mike, do you want to take that?

Okay. Yes, I'll pick up both of those. So firstly on rent caps, in Ireland, the existing regime is due to expire at the end of twenty twenty five. Now we know the government are looking at that. It's a little bit too early to say exactly what form any changes we'll make. But there remains a demand supply imbalance in the Irish market. And so we know the government is looking at The overall rent regime, we'll comment more when we know more. But it obviously is an interesting development for our portfolio. In terms of U. K. Office demand, we haven't seen any weakness coming off of that. I mean, the NASH Insurance changes come in place a little bit later this year. We've seen the take up for good quality offices in London be improving. We've seen that general trend if you were coming back to the offices, particularly good quality offices. And indeed, we've been seeing rents rising across most major submarkets for best in class offices. So we have strong belief that for best in class offices, there remains a really strong occupational market and we think our offices are really well positioned to take advantage of that and to capture rental growth over the medium and long term.

That's helpful. One more if you could indulge me. The core investment portfolio, again positive fair value marks That's the first time this has happened in a long time. If we think about a world where long term rates are stabilizing, let's not even call for them to decline. But if you're just kind of stabilizing over the next year or so, should we kind of expect that continued trend of positive fair value marks on the core investment portfolio and positive implications for carried interest.

I mean, it's always hard to predict the future. But I think if rates stay kind of where they are and stabilize, given the operational improvements we're seeing at our assets, I mean, I certainly our hope is certainly that values will continue to go up and that will be reflected in the fair value and promotes assuming that happens and I think It feels It feels that will be the case, but again, it's you can't predict the future on these things.

And Tayo, I would just add that I think that the landscape around the carried interest or promotes will continue to grow as we grow our management business and deploy new capital And so I think you're going to get both headwinds hopefully from what's what exists, but more importantly as we meaningfully grow that business and we have more promote and carried interest structures.

Sounds good. Really solid execution this quarter. Hold on, guys.

Thank you. Thank you. And your next question today will come from Jeff Spector with Bank of America.

Great. Thank you. First question, given you have such a great pulse [indiscernible] global institutional interest in U. S. Real estate and in other parts of the world, but specifically U. S. Real estate Just want to confirm from your recent conversations, are you seeing, hearing from any of your relationships any change in tone whether it's concerns over tariffs or other various initiatives proposed by the new administration, are you seeing any change in interest in U. S. Real estate maybe even other parts of the world. Thank you.

Good, interesting question.

Look, I just came back from a week in Asia. I can tell you that People are very, very interested in investing in The United States.

And I'm not passing any judgment. I'm just telling you that people have a very strong belief that the business environment in The United States is going to be Really good. Over the next three to four years. And when you look at the size of the market here with almost three fifty million people The capital markets, the capitalizations of the big companies here is just really, really attractive place to put capital [indiscernible] you've also got particularly Canada, where we've got some great relationships and in Asia where we've been now for thirty years and The Middle East, you've got these very, very large institutional partners that are are growing their their own capital base [indiscernible] they don't they can't deploy all of that capital in the markets that they're they're headquartered in So all of the major Japanese companies want to take some portion of their capital [indiscernible] here primarily here in The United States.

And it's pretty much true everywhere around the world. And I would say that particularly Asia, the other the secondary market that they feel very, very comfortable with is The United Kingdom.

One of the things that Matt said was, we were selling non core assets in Spain and Italy and they the whole idea behind all of that was really to focus our management team on our energy in the markets where we really have real expertise.

United States The United Kingdom, and Ireland And so we're really well positioned in all of these markets. And I would say the other great thing that's happened to us over the last couple of years is because our credit business is a national business. It's given us an information base outside of the Western United States. [indiscernible] look at other equity opportunities in other markets. We're currently under contract right now to buy five apartment communities in the Arizona market and the Texas market where we really haven't had equity investments in the past. I'm not ready to talk about it yet, but we're also looking at another opportunity that is well advanced in in the Southern Part Of The United States, And so The biggest issue was asset managing what we own. Getting out of these non core assets, particularly the office assets in some cases that we own 100% which we've been doing in The United States and we'll focus on that primarily in Europe this year, and then finding new ways to deploy capital, not new ways, but new markets to deploy capital into. We've got significant amounts of capital that our reputation is really, really strong.

People trust us to invest their money And so capital deployment really is really one of the key ways that we're going to continue to grow the business, particularly investment management business.

Thank you. Very helpful.

Follow-up to your continuing to exit office, you did mention that you're seeing some benefits from return to office in the Northwest. So just to confirm, nothing would change your view on office And I think also retail is the other area you're shifting away from?

Yes. I think in terms of our balance sheet investments, we're not looking to deploy balance sheet capital into those areas. That's not to say we wouldn't opportunistically look at things in that space. Using our investment management platform, there could be opportunities there. But for our balance sheet investments where we're deploying Our capital we think it's better served focusing on rental housing and industrial. And I would just add that the idea of growing the investment management business gives you a lot more flexibility around the return thresholds, right? Obviously, we have used our own balance sheet, but that business you have partners that have different return thresholds that they can invest at different interest in different product types. It really allows us to expand what we look at.

Thank you. And then just my last question on supply, apartment supply and you just were talking about some of the Texas, Arizona, Sunbelt, or Southern markets there is some concern that we could suddenly walk into '26 where supply is picking up. One of your apartment peers believes there's visibility through '26 that there's really not going to be an increase in supply. What are your views there on supply in the Sunbelt as you're and looking at the Southern markets? Thank you.

Yes, we've definitely seen it really from our credit business because we haven't invested to date our equity in the Sunbelt markets to speak of. But through our credit business, we're seeing it. And what we're finding is only the really the best in class developers are able to put together the capital stacks right now to build And so what you're seeing is very high stuff that's being built is best in class.

But the volumes and the starts continue to be significantly below where they were several years ago.

So it doesn't feel like it from what we're seeing in our [indiscernible] I think you'll see construction costs come down, interest rates come down further. To have supply become a significant issue in these markets over the next few years.

That being said, there's still supply coming and finishing, like projects that were financed two or three years ago, there's still some of that finishing up. But if you kind of look eighteen months ahead, it starts to definitely have a significant ramp down on deliveries.

Great. Thank you. [indiscernible] Well, thank you very much, everyone.

And We're going to be at next week at the [indiscernible] And so if there's anybody there, we'll look forward to that's on this call, we'll look forward to seeing you there. Thank you.

Conference has now concluded. Thank you for attending today's presentation.

May now disconnect.